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1941 model a john deere fan blade stopped turning whille I was bush hoggin

24K views 68 replies 7 participants last post by  Wi11y 
#1 ·
1941 model a john deere fan blade stopped turning whille I was bush hoggin.

I had been hearing some rotational noise for some time that worried me.
When the fan stopped turning, there was no more bad sound.
Now that that broke the engine sounds good. That is good to know since I was not sure of the noise source.

Buy the time I got the tractor to be barn there was some steam coming out of the radiator.

I have been looking on the internet to see how others have removed the fan shaft.

Where would yall start to assess is wrong? Before taking a lot apart.
I can turn the fan blade and seem to hear a little bit of rattling.
I cannot hear any sound in the governor box.
 
#2 ·
to be honest one could unbolt it and try to wiggle it out but chances of rad damage is there. the way we do it here is to take off the hood gas tank,grill and rad then that fan shaft. theres a couple bolt towards the fan end that hold it down then the ones on the governor. after there all removed you should be able to pull it strait forward then lift out. shure hope the gear isn't toast that'd be a lot of shavings down in the crank case
 
#4 ·
Well there are things I want to do if If I take that all off.

I appreciate the help yall. :)

Well there are things I want to do if If I take that all off. Minor items except for the work.
It will take me awhile.

I will post some pictures as I do it to help me and others of various items I encounter.
I need to put a bushing in the steering wheel, and tighten the front steering up some.
I will at least hammer out where someone chewed a hole in the hood to put a oval shaped muffler.
I may replace the muffler with an original while I have the hood off.

I believe that noise had been there since I got it last fall. It just slowly got more noticeable and worrisome.
 
#5 ·
We I have mostly taken it apart until I could get the fan shaft out.
The fan shaft gear and bearings are rusted and totally gone.

I will note that my hood came off separate from gas tank without much trouble.

I left the radiator on.
I needed 1/2 of clearance to clear the fan and was able to prize the end of the fan nut against the corner of the radiator with a big screw drive to compress it 1/2 inch to come out.
I had removed the fan shroud and pushed it behind the fan blade.
I did remove the pipe connected to the top of the radiator where water flows in there.

The gear box looks like it had big globs of gray grease. It really grease? Or did oil congeal over several years?
There looked to be rust dust on top of that grease.

I reckon the oil hole I read about has been stopped up for years.
I will remove the gear box and look over what other damage there is.
I have taken a lot of pictures for me to study and remember.
I will include more as I make progress. I am learning as I go.
You can offer advice or ask me questions.

There are alot of pictures here so you may have to wait on the page to load to see the list.
The bottom 2 rows show the fan shaft and inside the governor gear box.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDaPicturesIndex.htm
 
#6 ·
grey to me suggest there was water in the chamber that was mixed in with the rest of the lubrication.
 
#7 ·
Willy maybe that is it. I believe the tractor sat for several years after its 1st owner was gone.
The oil looked like whipped cream when I got it from it 2nd owner of just a couple of months.
Moisture had gotten in it during the cold of several years.
I do not think the radiator water was leaking into it.
I changed all fluids when I got it, but had no idea of what was in the governor.
I noticed a growing sound as I drove it which was that pinion gear grinding away.
I will empty it and look in it to size up any damage and change all fluids again as I work on the governor box.
Thank you
 
#8 ·
The boxer engines of John Deere tractors all leak in their cylinder castings. My 60 chose to do it through the wall onto the ground. It literally came through the metal and would drip the antifreeze.

A club that I was a part of in Vista California (http://agsem.com/) had advised all its owners to put a radiator drain cock on their oil drains. That when the owner planned to start their tractor, you were asked to open the drain plug slightly to let the water out of the oil prior to starting.

The fellow whom bought my 60 was familiar with this head ache and asked me where my leak was. I told him that mine went away when I painted the block with epoxy paint. In your case to find the leak you would probably have to remove the cylinder casting and take it to a machine shop and get it magna-fluxed.
 
#9 ·
Willy
From what you say, I would think that if drain oil from the bottom I might see some water/antifreeze now at the first of what comes out?
The tractor has sat for a month or so. I will check it and see. I hope I see none and that the water problem was condensation of its years of inactivity.
:)
I will post back what I see.
 
#10 ·
I drained the oil. I did not see water/antifreeze separate at the bottom. I am not sure if there is water mixed with the oil. It could be.
If so then it is not much. It is is not the creamy texture as when there is a lot of water present and the engine has whipped it up.
And yet it might be just slightly gray tinged compared to say car oil you drain. The engine has not been run for a month.
Next I will remove the gear box and see what gears to replace.
 
#11 ·
The water when/if there. It will only be a few drops. It is why the club said to install a radiator drain valve. You crack this valve prior to starting. Remove any condensate . seepage. Close the valve when oil starts to drip out. No need to drain the whole thing.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I had already intended to change all fluids last fall and then again this year.
There was so much cream in the crankcase and transmission case, I felt running it a few months would allow me to get more gunk and water out this year. That tinge of gray might be that little be of condensation that was left after the changes.
The pto was not creamy really last year but there was very thick sludge at the bottom.

Right now, I believe the oil passage got stopped some years back and sitting with condensation for more years let it rust at the top with no oil for years.

Willy I appreciate the help.
 
#13 ·
I dug into what appears to be grease - there is too much and too thick to be oil and water.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_4990.JPG

I believe someone tried to jury rig some oiling problem years back and packed this gear box full of grease.
I added a few pictures to jog my memory as this drags on.

I will take this gear box off sometime in the next week or so and learn some more.
 
#14 ·
Well it appears to be molybdenum grease. Yet there is a awful amount of rust in there. If we could get James Howell to post, we would get alot better info on how your tractor should get its lubrication.

This is presuming he isnt a casualty of not being able to log in from the password kill of the board.
 
#16 ·
I was advised to try to log in upto 6 times. That eventually the board will prompt you for "Forget your password?"
 
#17 ·
I tried to get the fan shaft gear off today. I removed the ring.
I tried heating with a propane torch and penetrating oil and some hammering.
I have stopped on the gear for now to do some research.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5008.JPG

I have removed battery tray and all items connecting to the governor.
I tried to lift the governor out but it is hanging on something.
I did not try too hard. I need to know does it just pull out?
I added to the picture trail.
 
#18 ·
None of my pullers are right to pull off this fan shaft gear. I will see if I can buy or rent one.

Magneto is stuck tight with the paint sealing it.

I removed the governor gear cap. I cannot figure out how to remove the gears. Maybe the fork is stuck holding the fan gear

I am thinking the no oil problem will not be just unstopping the oil hole by the gauge.
as I have cleaned much more grease out of there, it means some one did a patch job rather than fix the oil that they knew about.
the oil gauge has always showed oil pressure midway or better.
 
#19 ·
The oil pressure on the John Deere is minimal. Like around 3-8 psi. So you know.
I cant advise you better, I would suggest you get a service manual. It will help you with your quandries. I am puzzled why James Howell hasnt chimed in with his knowledge yet as he is much better informed than I.
 
#20 ·
I got magneto off. It had dry rust in it though it was still working good.

I believe rust may be holding the governor gears on the magneto shaft.
I can the fork out of the and the magneto weights move freely.

I will my fan shaft to town to try to match up to some puller.
Slowly but surely.

The picture trail grows.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDaPicturesIndex.htm
 
#21 ·
I borrowed a gear puller that would fit from advanced auto tech.
I removed the gear there in the parking lot in the be of my cj7.
It strained me a little but it is off.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5105.JPG

I then removed the crankcase cover to unscrew the oil feed in the bottom of the governor.
I had missed that line for my serial number tractor.
Now I have the governor off.
I will take it apart to see what I can salvage and what I will replace.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5130.JPG
http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5136.JPG

Engine looks good inside to me.
Just seems like no oil to the governor.
I will check that out.
 
#22 ·
wow, that bevel gear looks like some of the gear found on the local fishing boats exposed to salt water.


Eager to see how you do. Good documentation with the pictures. Keep it up!
 
#24 ·
I was sure unaware. Someone knew and packed the grease years ago I would think.
Perhaps the grease worked well till the tractor sat for a few years and got water condensation and the grease stiffened up when the tractor was started up again in the last year or 2.

But why not just fix it?
Maybe they heard the gears then or they also replaced the fan shaft gear and filled it with grease and did not dig any deeper to fix the oil flow problem.

I am going to try to prove the oil flow as I put it back together. Maybe I can start it with the fan shaft out and see the oil flow in action.

Now I can work on this sitting down. That will be good for a change.

Now that it is apart I can do a few other things that I can afford.
Rewire it.
Replace the temperature gauge that did not work.
Replace the oil gauge that did work but I could not see any markings, just a needle up in the middle.
Get the generator, voltage regulator and amp meter working once I have good wiring.
 
#25 ·
I got the john deere model a governor gear assembly out today

I got the governor gear assembly out today. I was rusted so that it I had to pry it out - gently till I could feel it move a little.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5181.JPG

I removed all the insides of the governor box and started cleaning the box.
I started cleaning the oil flows and understanding them.
I do not think I have seen the 'drilled hole' yet where oil would come and flow to the fan shaft gear or to the magneto side.

Now I will see about taking this gear assembly apart for a rebuild - unless I can find the entire assembly for sale.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDA_5198.JPG

Here again is the entire picture trail where I start to tear down the 1941 john deere model A fan shaft and governor.

http://www.duckpondconsulting.com/JDApictures/JDaPicturesIndex.htm
 
#26 ·
You might call Mcgrew Tractors. They have a john deere junkyard
 
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